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HVX200 additional info and corrections
Time to evangelize a bit and correct some mistakes from the original Panasonic HVX200 review. Here are the deets:
1080i or 1080p... Which is it?
In the original article I talked about how the camera is not 1080p, it's really 1080i. This is simply wrong, and I have no idea what I was thinking. When recording 1080p24 or 1080p30 the signal recorded to tape is actually 1080i60 (OK, maybe that's why I was thinking it was 1080i). So the signal on tape is interlaced, but it uses the same technology that the DVX100 uses to essentially pull out the interlacing. For 1080p30 content the image below shows how they can just combine the two fields again to make a whole progressive image.
That's pretty basic stuff. While the camera is 1080i60 on tape, your NLEis working with 1080p30 without any interlacing artifacts or problems. Just make sure to either pull out the interlacing with a program, or tell your NLE to be working in progressive mode and not 1080i. 1080p24 is a bit more complex and requires 2:3:3:2 pulldown to accomplish this. For a guide on that, I'll send you to Adam Wilt, the authority on all things DV. The techie version is that 24 progressive frames are broken into 60 fields, then the progressive information is pulled back out of the 60 fields by your NLE. The end result is a very beautiful 24p. So yes, the HVX200 is a true progressive camera in the same sense that the DVX100 is a true 24p camera.
Viewfinder
I would like to clarify the viewfinder a bit. I still stand by my opinion that it's hard to focus and focus fast, which can be important from time to time. I had a couple people ask if I tried things like focus assist and turning the viewfinder to black & white, and yes I did. This is my gripe on all DV and HDV cameras as opposed to a pro grade camera like the Varicam, which has a beautiful viewfinder. Let me be clear though, the HVX200 is a $6,000 camera and the Varicam is a $65,000 camera (and I'm not sure the viewfinder is even included in that price). Panasonic needs to ensure that the cost of the camera is reasonable, and I respect that; however, the viewfinder is very important and I believe that it's not as good as it should be. It was also brought up that the higer the dot-pitch, the dimmer the viewfinder becomes. Now maybe I'm crazy, but I believe a stronger backlight fixes that issue (not an engineer, but it makes sense to me). The viewfinder is no worse than any other DV/HDV camera, but no better either. I hold Panasonic to a higher level of excellence than other companies simply because their products are typically that much better than everyone else. I honestly expected a better viewfinder and am disappointed at the route they took. I know better systems exsist, I have seen and used them before in pro-grade gear. And that's why this is a prosumer camera and not professional.
Firestore FS-100
I said that the Firestore FS-100 would be able to hold a couple of hours, and in reailty it can hold about 90 minutes. The limitation is the 2.5" firewire hard drive that is used, which in this system is not removable, so it can not be upgraded easily. I eagerly await a P2 card that can hold 100GB and would buy that over a hard drive solution in a heartbeat, but to date the largest size they have is 8GB. The HVX200 has two P2 slots, so at 720p60 you can get about 16 minutes of recording at once. Not even close to long enough for us.
Conclusion
Forget HDV, DVCPRO HD is the way to go. The HVX200 is the first camera to bring DVCPRO HD pricing into the realm of the prosumer. If you're at all serious about HD, then HDV is out the window and this is the only way to go. Panasonic has a clear vision of HD and far better products than anyone else out there in both the prosumer realm and the professional realm. I am more and more convinsed that the HXV200 is the right camera for Technology Evangelist, and I am absolutly sure that for $6,000 every prosumer looking at HDV should forgo that and move straight to the HVX200.
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2. Posted by: Benjamin Higginbotham on February 11, 2006 10:45 PM:
DVCPRO HD is only 100Mbps, so a hard drive can capture the data stream just fine. Keep in mind that unless you move to a format such as HD D5, the image on the tape will be compressed. DVCPRO HD is 100Mbps whereas HDV is 25Mbps. Hence, the DVCPRO HD format has 4x the bandwidth of HDV, which means a LOT better picture... But to answer your question, the advantage of P2 is that there are no moving parts, and being that P2 is a broadcast medium, just like Betacam SP, it's designed for videographers in the field who will be beating up on it. While hard drives are nice, if you give it a good enough bump, you can screw up the data stream, ruining a shot. NOT a good thing for a professional videographer. In most cases hard drives are fine, but from a pro standpoint P2 is better and more stable... It's just freaking expensive.
The problem with HDV is that it's MPEG 2, or an IBP structure. This means that the potential for frame failure as well as macroblocking is much higher than with the DVCPRO HD format. Easiest way to think of it is HDV is a consumer format whereas DVCPRO HD is a professional format. In fact, until the HVX200, the least expensive DVCPRO HD camera out there was the Varicam at $65,000, not including the lens. This is the first time DVCPRO HD has been brought out of high-end broadcast and into high-end prosumer. It's a HUGE deal and will give HDV a run for its money in the prosumer market.
While the HXV200 is recording 1080i60 on the tape, it's capturing from the CCD at 1080p then duplicating the fields. This means that when you bring it back into your NLE, as long as you tell the NLE to convert it back to progressive, then you really will be editing in 1080p30 or 1080p24. 1080p30 will be easier to edit as it's just merging the two fields together to make a whole frame; however, 24p will be a bit more complex and require 2:3:3:2 pulldown to get your progressive frames back. This is the same technique that the DVX100 camera uses, and it works great. It really is progressive, it's just storing the progressive data on the tape as interlaced then converting it back to progressive in the NLE... But no data is lost in this process, it is still truly progressive.
The Sony HC1 is really not a good camera to compare to the HXV200... The HC1 is a consumer camera whereas the HVX200 is a prosumer camera. The better comparison would be the Sony Z1 HDV camera, and even then we're comparing the horrid 25Mbps HDV stream to the much nicer 100Mbps DVCPRO HD stream. If you're a home user looking for an HD camera to play with then HDV is fine. If you're a pro or need to make money with your camera, then you should really stay away from HDV and move to DVCPRO HD or another non long-GOP (IBP) format.
The camera is not by any means Star Wars quality, but keep in mind that for Star Wars they had a MUCH more expensive system. It is a lot better than the HC1 and will prevent most of the macro-blocking that you're seeing. It's also a lot harder to use than the HC1 and more along the size of a small professional camera, not a home camcorder like the HC1. So it's a bit of a different beast. I'll try and get her back and take a picture of it in my hands.
Hope that answered all your questions... Had quite a few there :)
3. Posted by: JD on February 15, 2006 6:11 AM:
There IS a hot-swappable HD option coming for it:
http://www.spec-comm.com/cineporterdata.php
Just so everyone knows.
4. Posted by: Benjamin J. Higginbotham on February 15, 2006 9:00 AM:
A true hot swap drive, or just a removable drive?
With an actual hot swap I would be able to be recording, swap out the old drive and swap in a new drive, yet loose no data in the process. Be it a memory buffer built in to the unit, a second removable drive, whatever... If I can just remove the drive and add another... no big deal. If I really CAN hot swap, then yeah, that's a huge deal!
5. Posted by: Pieter Mali on February 17, 2006 10:16 AM:
I don't understand the advantage of " hot swappability": if you take a P2-card out, the camera will move and the shot is spoilt. Do I miss something?
6. Posted by: Benjamin Higginbotham on February 18, 2006 3:30 PM:
From a P2 standpoint, yes the camera would shake... But from a hard drive standpoint, since it does not need to be mounted to the tripod, one could swap out drives without adjusting the shot at all. Just need to be quiet when doing it :)
7. Posted by: fannyslacks on May 4, 2006 12:43 AM:
saying that the hvx200 is a '$6000' camera is kind of wrong.. to get the camera to a place where it is functional in the same capacity as a normal hdv cam, you have to spend closer to $10,000.
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1. Posted by: Charbax on February 11, 2006 9:10 PM:
Thanks for your awesome review..
Though Sony HDR-HC1 is less than 1000$ now, very small and light thus suitable for Steadicam Merlin..
Only problem with HDV I think is pans and shaking handheld camera. Though I think it will be great HD quality with a steadicam or as long as one uses the tripod..
I'll have to learn more about the Panasonic though..
But I just don't understand why Panasonic doesn't build a removable 2,5" harddrive storage into the camera instead of P2 cards.. does the harddrive technology not have enough bitrate speed for lossless full HD? And I need to re read what you have written about the 1080p30 and 1080p24.. It sounds like this Panasonic does 1080i60 because it's less processor requiring than doing directly 1080p30, and it would't be as good..
How does video look when you pan and shake the camera handheld? Does it look out-of-focus like the HDV mpeg2 compression or i it amazingly Star Wars quality?